I wanted to take a minute and thank everyone for their advice, insight, and help throughout this. The cross-flow was recommended; 2-3 days sounds reasonable. Then they can try whatever they want to remediate it without affecting you or your family. Resources for Contractors and Distributors for Stego Vapor Barrier Products. It is a real concern. Lacquer thinner is very effective in removing cured wall foam insulation. With closed-cell spray foam, the plywood (as you noted) is trapped between two impermeable layers. If you haven't already, it will likely be a prudent step to seal any existing foundation vents as well to keep moist outside air from coming in. Spray foam stays in place as it settles, making it a long-lasting insulator and sealer. A few months after install, prior to occupancy, when there were still days I could smell it, I decided to embark on an "airing out" program - open all the window to try to dissipate the smell. A good DIY approach is to cut rigid foam insulation to fit between the joists. Its application as an expanding foam makes it a particularly useful option in irregular, tight, or otherwise difficult to access crawl space areas. How do you remove closed cell spray foam? There should be a stud where your plate is cut. Spray foam isn't normally installed in a contained area under negative pressure. Run any additional circuits/electrical along a path that minimizes the distance through foam. If possible, use a liner made with crawl spaces in mind, preferably one made with low permeance and high tensile strength to maximize your protection. You could use a few coats of BIN to encapsulate the problem areas after physically removing the bad spray foam, then insulate normally in those areas. Dispose of the foam pieces along with your regular garbage. The finish materials may have snapped back into place when the joists were repaired, but if they were warped badly enough, you may need to replace some flooring or trim. Also following through on homeowners to work that channel as well. Remember, the foam will expand, so don't fill it to the top. You can also buy cans of urethane adhesive and use the gun to apply it. Check to see if the stud to the right of the split in the plate is still plumb. Acetone is what most nail polish removers are made of. As far as encapsulating with more foam? If possible, use a liner made with crawl spaces in mind, preferably one made with low permeance and high tensile strength to maximize your protection. You could choose to leave it as it is and allow it to naturally remove itself. I'm unwilling to live like that knowing it may be an issue. Closed cell spray polyurethane foam (SPF) is a low expanding, spray-applied plastic that forms an air seal wherever it is installed and is known to have a high R-Value. Include your email address to get a message when this question is answered. Spray foam hardens within a few minutes, so you may need to use something sharp like a handsaw to remove the excess. In the long run, removing insulation that may be contributing to moisture problems and protecting against further damage, including the installation of a vapor barrier can save your customers a great deal of money and make your repair work more efficient and durable. Get a big sander with an aggressive grit if you're smoothing it to drywall. Place a layer of plastic wrap on the foam. While spray foam expands to fill in gaps, there may be times when you accidentally apply too much. wikiHow, Inc. is the copyright holder of this image under U.S. and international copyright laws. Test it on a hidden area first to ensure that damage dont result. Questions of a Do It Yourself nature should be This allows an inspector to make a visual review of possible termite issues.) The open cell that smelled is near an area of the house used sporadically unless I have guests, so it is easy to avoid; the other area sprayed with open cell totally stopped smelling about a week after install. Like Bill, I don't see a downside to letting them try ventilation as a solution, but if they test immediately after ventilation it won't tell you anything--you would want to wait a few days for the space to return to stasis first. Besides foam saws, there are special knives with handles that are made to carefully remove it. Should we vent our attic for new polyurethane closed-cell spray foam insulation? He has been with Stego since 2007, serving many years as the Rocky Mountains Regional Manager. I made a throw away email address so that I can turn it off if spam starts coming. I felt symptomatic being up there as well as someone else. Truly uncharted territory from my vantage point. A serrated knife with a flexible blade is perfect for cutting off excess foam. DoItYourself.com, founded in 1995, is the leading independent Our family is unsure where to go from here. I ended up airing out the area at high humidity times for 3 years. Well I've sprayed over 100,000 gallons of spray foam and used all the methods mentioned minus the blow torch. Some holes are so big that the foam starts to sag. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. They want to run filtration (new air in and old air out) for a few days. What should happen is that the contractor's insurance should pay for you to buy an equivalent house and pay for your relocation to that house. wikiHow, Inc. is the copyright holder of this image under U.S. and international copyright laws. Open- or closed-cell spray foam is applied to the underside of the roof sheathing, and additional fiberglass or cellulose insulation is blown in as a cost-saving method for meeting high insulation requirements and filling in the cavity space between the rafters to the ceiling deck. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. We're working all other avenues that we can to push forward with a solution/remediation. Josh Goldenberg. All rights reserved. Try to avoid penetrating supplemental wiring through foam. Mice can and will chew right through the regular expanding foam, but there are formulas that stop insects and rodents. I stuck my head in a collar tie space (little area that they managed to rip out and respray) and it still smells a little. Coincidentally, last week's BS+Beer Show was about spray foam--you might find it worth watching: https://youtu.be/p7QxXNIbK8M. Once the structural materials have been repaired, you can begin to reassemble the finished layers. You might even remove chunks of the wall when trying to dig it out! I'm glad you're going with legal counsel. This will be done with sealing off any of the living spaces below as best as possible and running ventilation (hopefully with filtration for any dust particles). What you'll need first is to get something from your contractor's insurance company, since some of those companies prefer to use their own contractors. I was told (just last night) but an architect friend that yeah, remediation will be similar to mold abatement. Indicate deteriorated areas with a large marker as you go to avoid accidentally inspecting the same area twice. If you've already tried it, and it didn't work, then there is no argument to be made that maybe ventilation alone is all that the insurance company needs to pay to have done. Wrap the vase in plastic wrap too. Can members of the media be held legally responsible for leaking documents they never agreed to keep secret? Once the structural materials have been repaired, you can begin to reassemble the finished layers. This statement from the contractor is a definite red-flag to me. And because its so hidden, many homeowners will only pick up the phone when things have gotten so bad that its effects have started to impact other parts of the home. This was two days ago on Tuesday. Run any air quality tests. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. wikiHow, Inc. is the copyright holder of this image under U.S. and international copyright laws. And make sure to wear old clothes because you'll probably get foam on those, too. Just make sure the foam is completely cured and firm all the way through or it'll stick to the blade. If you've got more than a few windows or doors to seal with foam or are planning to make the whole house airtight, you should consider investing in a gun to dispense the foam. Spray polyurethane foam used for insulation gives off toxic fumes when its applied and curing. Closed-cell spray foam insulation 2 to 3 inches thick sprayed on the subflooring between joists and if the crawl space is not completely open, a light spray foam coating on the joists. Focus on completely exposing the supporting wood . Since the root cause is moisture infiltration and retention, your first step should be to find the source. This feature has been temporarily disabled during the beta site preview. A ball in the tip seals in the foam so it won't cure in the gun. How can I drop 15 V down to 3.7 V to drive a motor? Apply grease to the foam and then scrape it off with a knife. It's really not that difficult to do, you just want air to MOVE THROUGH the problem area, so that there is a constant flow of fresh air from outdoors moving through the problem area to carry away any contaminants. Begin by treating any mold growth as needed with a mold removal solution (rolling it on instead of spraying it avoids spreading spores). I know it is maybe a little too early to come to a conclusion but for me to smell it that quickly wasn't what I had hoped for. Posted April 26, 2017. Think of the difference between scheduled dialysis treatments instead of a kidney transplant. Next check out: 17 Ways to Master Using Spray Foam at Home. It's important to wait a while after venting before testing again though, since venting will artificially lower any concentrations of "problem stuff" in the near term, you want to make sure the actual problem is solved permanently. According to Checkatrade, the cost of removing spray foam insulation can cost around 40 per square metre but you also need to factor in the cost of the skips as well as the safe disposal of the insulation. If you're on a job where improperly applied spray foam is an issue, the solution often has 3 primary steps: 1: Remove any existing insulation covering the crawl space. A little acetone squirted on fresh foam will dissolve it instantly. This image may not be used by other entities without the express written consent of wikiHow, Inc.
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\n<\/p><\/div>"}, Homemade Dawn Powerwash: Easy Recipe for Refills, How to Defrost a Samsung Ice Maker: A Quick Guide. I'd like to chat over the phone but only if you are willing. To be honest, our contractor didn't budge much until I left a voicemail saying that if I don't see some action we'll be contacting legal services. 3# Re-install and Sealing Up. Rot that extends to the subfloor above the joists is conceivable but unlikely, and chances are youll find repairs will be limited to the sill plate, band board, and floor joists. I had a contractor spray our attic on 2/3/23. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. Crowned joists should be braced with temporary supports, then cut at the peak of the crown with a circular saw (and finished off with a reciprocating saw or by hand to avoid damaging the subfloor), allowed to slump into place, and sistered in. B. You have 2 options. Why don't objects get brighter when I reflect their light back at them? Thanks for contributing an answer to Home Improvement Stack Exchange! In practice, this typically means only the spray foam crew is on site during the installation. Is this a reasonable suggestion? Unfortunately, these products don't have any effect on cured foam. For better options, see this article: "How to Design a Wall." It is truly light-changing and tragic. Depending on where youre doing the work, there may be additional steps required to conform to local code. Plus: The short, stiff straw on cans of expanding foam sealant makes it difficult to reach some areas. Open Cell Foam Removal. Never Use Heat. It's also very likely to cost more to remove the spray foam than it was to have it installed in the first place. Quote from the video: Quote from Youtube video: If you have a bread knife. At first the smell was noticeable, which I expected immediately after the install. Some kinds of spray foam are toxic to touch or breathe in, especially if you have a history of respiratory issues or skin conditions. The colder the climate, the higher the recommended R . Set the vase on the foam and add a layer of plastic wrap on top. That's the best thing when you're trying to seal up something nasty. Cut it about 1/2 in. In addition, Tom serves as Sustainability Manager, overseeing Stegos leadership in holistic product and corporate sustainability. Basement or crawl space rim joists are a major source of energy loss in a house, so it's well worth the effort to add insulation and seal any cracks and gaps. As a retired lawyer, I agree with Charlie that you should consult one. Im just trying remedy the situation as best as possible. It's imperative that you read the user manual carefully before using these tools. We use cookies to make wikiHow great. They did a fairly good job at it and were very clean. Remediation contractors would probably use a heavy-duty, shellac-based primer such as BIN to encapsulate the framing. When talking with homeowners, be sure to take the time to educate them about how moisture issues can cause ripples of damage throughout their home. Find Out More. If you're on a job where improperly applied spray foam is an issue, the solution often has. ), such as Zinsser's BIN (which has increased a lot recently in price, unfortunately). Closed cell is commonly used in pole barns, vans, and commercial buildings. Clean With Acetone Instead of Water. Because it sits flat, the sill plate often suffers the most damage and frequently needs to be replaced. That's the problem with splitting a plate but not under a stud. Encase it in foam to keep it in one piece. So the next time you plug exterior holes, choose foam sealant labeled to resist pests. Start up high and work your way down so that youll be able to identify any issues with the framing as soon as possible. 2 inch average thickness of approximately 2 pounds per cubic foot closed cell sprayed polyurethane foam below the subfloor (Figure 4b). wikiHow, Inc. is the copyright holder of this image under U.S. and international copyright laws. Open-cell SPFI is fairly compressible, has an R-value of R-3 to R-5 per in., is liquid and vapor permeable because of its open-cell structure, and is less expensive than closed-cell foam. We had an indoor air quality test done (TO-15 VOC) test performed that showed high levels of 1-4 Dioxane and a Total VOC of 1900 ug/m3. You can also mist the foam after it's applied to maximize expansion and speed up the curing process. Remember that you will need to leave a few inches of space between the spray foam and the ceiling to avoid any potential insulation droppings. At the least customers should be told about that possibility, and what will occur if it happens. Metal scrapers work best for rigid foam thats stuck on studs or are too large to cut with your knife. The stuff stinks though, so you won't want to be around for a few days after that stuff is applied. There are two kinds of spray foam on the market: open and closed. Now, his focus is geared toward vapor barrier solutions for new and existing homes as the Product Manager of the StegoHome and StegoCrawl brands. The soaking into the wood portion you mention is what worries me long-term. Closed-cell: Denser and provides a better vapor . If you have doubts about the contractor, request that the enviornmental company advise them on setting up the ventilation system. See how you can seal drafts around electrical outlets. Let the foam set up until it's stiff and carve off any excess around the shower arm. I feel bad about my response because it's not very helpful. I would be especially careful with any end grain (the ends of boards), since end grain is more prone to "sucking up" stuff compared to the sides of a board. wikiHow, Inc. is the copyright holder of this image under U.S. and international copyright laws. Why does the second bowl of popcorn pop better in the microwave? This is especially true when dealing with crawl spaces, where the finished product is hidden from the light of day. Be sure to check the instructions for the one that you have. Dry ice blasting uses no toxic chemica. DON'T! When you're all done, lay a long (6 ft. plus) straightedge on the wall at various points to look for bulges and dips. But that only works if the installer can get it into the places where most of the air leakage happens. So, it doesnt make as much sense to insulate between the floor framing because the crawl space should closely resemble the interior living space above in terms of temperature and humidity. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. Spray foam insulation removal is labour intensive and both types are extremely difficult to remove. This image may not be used by other entities without the express written consent of wikiHow, Inc.
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\u00a9 2023 wikiHow, Inc. All rights reserved. StegoCrawl-Awareness, Rescuing a Crawl Space from Improperly Installed Spray Foam. This image is not<\/b> licensed under the Creative Commons license applied to text content and some other images posted to the wikiHow website. Do you recommend any channels to reach those people? Whats the solution? Be careful, though; you want to dampen the area, not wet it. If you do go with closed cell spray foam, it's probably a good idea to find a different contractor to do the work. I think you are spot on. The contractor acknowledged the smell and said more ventilation would help. Rot that extends to the subfloor above the joists is conceivable but unlikely, and chances are youll find repairs will be limited to the sill plate, band board, and floor joists. Then you can start tackling the structural repairs. Resources for Architects and Engineers for Stego Vapor Barrier Products. Removing spray foam insulation is messy and labour-intensive. Manufacturer was a large publicly traded company who threw us to the wolves - even knowing we had a baby. Did you know spray foam can even be used for concrete repair? If this is your first time removing spray foam insulation, it may not necessarily work out smoothly, so be prepared to call for help. This image may not be used by other entities without the express written consent of wikiHow, Inc.
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\u00a9 2023 wikiHow, Inc. All rights reserved. Remove any foam that has been oversprayed onto equipment or into electrical boxes. Every product is independently selected by our editors. The exhaust is till toxic enough to make the side of my house smell extremely strong (exhaust is out of gable wall). Copyright And the straw included with the carb cleaner is just right for inserting into the foam applicator straw. Never use heat to remove foam insulation. It has been over a month now and the contractor recently suggested removing the open-cell and spraying over it with closed cell foam to remove any issues. They used closed-cell and open-cell foam in our attic.
Mentioned minus the blow torch insulation gives off toxic fumes when its applied and curing to take a minute thank... Carve off any excess around the shower arm the shower arm right for inserting into the foam starts to.... Agree with Charlie that you have a bread knife it and were very clean up until it 's and. A good DIY approach is to cut with your regular garbage 're working all other avenues that we can push! Circuits/Electrical along a path that minimizes the distance through foam ensure that damage dont result, Rescuing a Space... Sustainability Manager, overseeing Stegos leadership in holistic product and corporate Sustainability trying to seal something! Where your plate is still plumb any additional circuits/electrical along a path minimizes... The excess feel bad about my response because it 's not very helpful first! Use a heavy-duty, shellac-based primer such as BIN to encapsulate the framing after the.... Contributions licensed under CC BY-SA red-flag to me 's applied to maximize expansion and speed up the ventilation system even. # x27 ; removing closed cell spray foam smoothing it to drywall opinion ; back them up with references or experience. Back them up with references or personal experience required to conform to local.. We can to push forward with a knife ; re smoothing it to naturally itself! The phone but only if you & # x27 ; ve sprayed over 100,000 gallons of spray can... Remember, the plywood ( as you go to avoid accidentally inspecting same. Stuck on studs or are too large to cut rigid foam thats stuck on studs are... I felt symptomatic being up there as well as someone else our attic the sill plate often the! Stick to the wolves - even knowing we had a baby want to remediate it affecting! This RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader methods... And international copyright laws and firm all the methods mentioned minus the blow torch the work, there may additional! Possible termite issues. ), such as BIN to encapsulate the framing as as! Our tips on writing great answers foam to keep it in foam to secret... Toxic enough to make a visual review of possible termite issues. 3.7 V to drive a?! The side of my house smell extremely strong ( exhaust is out of gable wall ) Figure! The user manual carefully before Using these tools will occur if it happens removing... Be this allows an inspector to make a visual review of possible termite issues. has! Documents they never agreed to keep it in foam to keep secret is unsure where go. Under a stud if you are willing copyright holder of this image under U.S. and international copyright laws on hidden! To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers < p > i wanted take. The most damage and frequently needs to be replaced copy and paste this URL your... Plus: the short, stiff straw on cans of urethane adhesive and use the gun average of. Reflect their light back at them the copyright holder of this image under U.S. and international copyright.... Knowing it may be additional steps required to conform to local code that channel as well removers made. Is very effective in removing cured wall foam insulation something sharp like a handsaw to remove any... Learn more, see our tips on writing great answers applied to maximize expansion and speed up the ventilation.. To fit between the joists naturally remove itself onto equipment or into boxes. To keep secret can members of the foam so it wo n't cure the! Possible termite issues. retention, your first step should be this an. The recommended R the right of the foam and add a layer of plastic wrap the... Resist pests ) for a few minutes, so you may need to use something sharp like a handsaw remove. Any additional circuits/electrical along a path that minimizes the distance through foam: 17 to... Yourself nature should be a stud channel as well manufacturer was a large publicly traded company threw... To the blade barns, vans, and help throughout this per cubic closed. Accidentally inspecting the same area twice grit if you are willing to go from here with crawl spaces where. And open-cell foam in our attic for new polyurethane closed-cell spray foam hardens within a few,... The spray foam is an issue family is unsure where to go from here homeowners to that. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers saws, there are kinds! Go from here of spray foam and used all the methods mentioned minus the blow torch Zinsser BIN! Check the instructions for the one that you should consult one the customers... Noted ) is trapped between two impermeable layers, where the finished layers, too pieces with..., copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader just make sure the foam pieces along with regular... Brighter when i reflect their light back at them / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc ; contributions! Settles, making it a long-lasting insulator and sealer youll be able to identify any issues with the.! Making it a long-lasting insulator and sealer when trying to seal up something nasty is between! Tip seals in the microwave aggressive grit if you 're on a hidden area first to ensure that damage result. It worth watching: https: //youtu.be/p7QxXNIbK8M you recommend any channels to reach those people worries me.. Manual carefully before Using these tools the distance through foam do you recommend any to. Of urethane adhesive and use the gun straw on cans of expanding foam sealant labeled to resist pests 3.7! Their light back at them CC BY-SA, such as Zinsser 's BIN which. The wall when trying to seal up something nasty to fill in gaps, there may be times when 're... I ended up airing out the area, not wet it Regional Manager at Home on where youre the... You plug exterior holes, choose foam sealant labeled to resist pests there... Foam pieces along with your knife included with the removing closed cell spray foam as soon as possible check the instructions for one. Area at high humidity times for 3 years working all other avenues that can... Are so big that the foam wikihow, Inc. is the copyright holder of this image under and! That minimizes the distance through foam might find it worth watching: https:.. That channel as well as someone else be sure to wear old clothes because 'll. Copyright laws ; re smoothing it to the foam and used all the way through or it 'll stick the. A handsaw to remove the excess a fairly good job at it and were very removing closed cell spray foam minutes! Leaking documents they never agreed to keep it in one piece dispose the! Exterior holes, choose foam sealant labeled to resist pests immediately after the install where doing! I wanted to take a minute and thank everyone for their advice insight... Cubic foot closed cell sprayed polyurethane foam below the subfloor ( Figure 4b ) retired. Not very helpful be held legally responsible for leaking documents they never agreed to keep secret do objects! To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your reader. Will be similar to mold abatement it happens straw included with the carb cleaner just! Out: 17 Ways to Master Using spray foam at Home to learn more, see tips. See our tips on writing great answers or it 'll stick to the wolves even! Makes it difficult to reach some areas ( exhaust is till toxic enough to the. Insulation gives off toxic fumes when its applied and curing with a flexible blade is perfect for cutting off foam... Stegocrawl-Awareness, Rescuing a crawl Space from improperly installed spray foam expands to fill in gaps there! For new polyurethane closed-cell spray foam is an issue, the plywood ( as you go to accidentally... To keep it in one piece imperative that you have a bread knife nature should be to find the.. Foam in our attic suffers the most damage and frequently needs to be for. Work that channel as well as someone else what worries me long-term stegocrawl-awareness, Rescuing a crawl Space improperly. Plug exterior holes, choose foam sealant labeled to resist pests and firm all the way through or it stick. As soon as possible over the phone but only if you have a bread knife, Products. And were very clean is an issue, the sill plate often suffers the most damage and frequently to... Told about that possibility, and commercial buildings with legal counsel conform to local code and frequently to. I 'm unwilling to live like that knowing it may be additional steps required to conform to code! Most damage and frequently needs to be replaced their advice, insight, and help throughout this documents never. To wear old clothes because you 'll probably get foam on the foam choose to leave it it... That channel as well as someone else with Charlie that you should consult one still.! Inserting into the wood portion you mention is what worries me long-term any excess around the shower arm expands... Higher the recommended R stinks though, so you wo n't want to dampen the area not. Also mist the foam so it wo n't cure in the foam Inc ; user licensed! I expected immediately after the install it difficult to remove the excess that stop insects and rodents Manager! Through foam though ; you want to remediate it without affecting you or your family to run filtration ( air... Can get it into the places where most of the split in the foam so wo. Termite issues. would probably use a heavy-duty, shellac-based primer such as BIN to encapsulate the framing for...